Subtitle: Imagination taking power

From What If to What Next: Episode Twenty Eight.

The time for imagining that change happens in small, incremental steps is now way behind us. As Naomi Klein says, “there are no non-radical solutions left”. Today we are thinking big. Really big. With big thinkers. While some of our episodes focus on what if questions that are quite specific and focused, in this episode, Episode Twenty-Eight, we are thinking big, so hang on to your hats. Luckily we have two guests for you who are brilliant at thinking big.

Atossa Soltani has been a global campaigner for tropical rainforests and indigenous rights, for going on three decades. She is founder and board president of Amazon Watch and served as the organization’s first executive director for eighteen years. Currently she is the director of global strategy for Amazon Sacred Headwaters Initiative working in alliance with 30 indigenous nations to protect 86 million acres in the most biologically diverse ecosystem on Earth. She is the Hillary Institute 2013 Global Laureate for Climate Leadership and is a producer of The Flow, a feature-length documentary currently in production on learning from nature’s genius. Stand by, you’re going to love this…

Jeremy Lent is an author and speaker whose work investigates the underlying causes of our civilization’s existential crisis, and explores pathways toward a life-affirming future. His award-winning book, The Patterning Instinct: A Cultural History of Humanity’s Search for Meaning, examines the way humans have made meaning from the cosmos from hunter-gatherer times to the present day. His upcoming book, The Web of Meaning: Integrating Science and Traditional Wisdom to Find Our Place in the Universe, will be published in June this year. He is founder of the nonprofit Liology Institute, dedicated to fostering an integrated worldview that could enable humanity to thrive sustainably on the Earth, and he writes topical articles exploring the deeper patterns of political and cultural developments at the blog Patterns of Meaning.


  1. deborah barnes
    July 3, 2021

    Just seeing this now. The Flow (Water the Flow paralleled human and water systems) was the title of an arts installation i did back in 2013 or so. However as this looks to be another “top down” educating event(s) it is limiting by design. The format itself is so controlled by the errors of past beliefs, even tho new tech promised much more 🙂 I am curious about your concept of the transitional process. The whole eco movement had a great start, and yet back in the early 2000s was gagged and hacked. Why? That said, educating attempts are great but only go so far by design. They trip on the very things that allow them access. How can we as a species actually move into a next reality unless we create a greater lens ? Maybe you have yet to reach this place as is not based on the old format.

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